Should Trial Strike currencies be located after their normal currency or together at the end?

Hello,

Not a big problem, but as title. There are basically two ways of ordering the currencies when there are two or more currencies that have trial strike versions in their own separate currencies, here I use an example of a fictional issuer that used the pound sterling until 1853, when it switched to the lira:

Way 1:
Trial strike currencies are arranged after their "normal" currency:

Pound sterling (1844-1853)
Trial Strikes (1844-1853)
Lira (1853-1874)
Trial Strikes (1853-1874)

Way 2:
Trial strike currencies are arranged in the same order as their normal currencies, but together at the end:

Pound sterling (1844-1853)
Lira (1853-1874)
Trial Strikes (1844-1853)
Trial Strikes (1853-1874)

I ask this because currently one of my issuers has it arranged as Way 1 (Congo - Republic) and another has them arranged as Way 2 (Ceylon). Which one should we adopt as standard?

Hello,
For me, they should appear together.

However, I thought about it yesteday and I was wondering if they should have their own category in the exonumia section as they are not intended to circulate : by definition a pattern is not a coin but a prototype, so something related to the coins.

Exonumian > Patterns > Country (and then by period like the coins)

Hello.
There is a third way: do not allocate trial strikes in a separate currency.

Cita: "Cyrillius"​Hello.
​There is a third way: do not allocate trial strikes in a separate currency.

​Well, duh, but then they tend to crowd out the normal strikes, making it much harder for the non-trial-strike-collecting majority to see what types they may be missing.

(By the way, you can always use the filter and remove the patterns.)

I prefer the first way.

Chronologically, it seem like a better representation than the second way, and technically, those trial strikes are not from a different currency. If the trial strikes come right after the currency they belong to, it shows that those trial strikes were made for the preceding currency (unlike the second way, which would have the currencies separated by multiple other currencies).

(And I feel like I should add that I am not as much a fan of the trial strikes being included in the regular currency section--I prefer them separate.)

@Sulfur

I was leaning towards the first way too; could you rearrange the Ceylon trial strike currency to be like it?

Thanks!

I would if I could, but currencies are beyond my power. You will have to wait until Jarek see this.

I insist... a pattern is not a coin.
I still think they should be seperated from them.

Some pattern designs were completely rejected and even if some of them circulated by error, they have no legal tender.

Coins, patterns, token, medal, coin weights are different things. A pattern is related to the coins and has a coin shape, but in theory we can't use them in a transaction.
It's one of the closest thing related to the coins but, like the other one I mentioned, it's still an exonumia to me. They should appear in this section.

If we continue to add them along the coins in the catalog, we would have more patterns than coins in the "coin section" for the modern period...

Cyncos has a point.

The only argument I can think of keeping patterns with their issuer's coins is the fact that they are listed together in the SCWC, but then again there are coins with X# that are listed not in Tokens or Exonumia.

But the only benefit for me is that if we move all patterns to exonumia, I won't have to spend time adding all of them.

Cita: "Cyrillius"​Hello.
​There is a third way: do not allocate trial strikes in a separate currency.

​Hmm in that case what should i do with almost 700 trial strikes from Poland - only from the Polish People's Republic?

I think the Trial Strikes should be as separate currency. I like the second way. I don't collect trial strikes although i have some and im angry when checking which coins i miss i must search my coin between trial strikes. i.e.

I wish I could say we will discuss it at admin meeting, but that could be god knows when...

Cycnos is technically right, but I suspect there will be some oposition for full move under Exonumia. Cyrillius is right that we can easily filter them.

Separate currency is somewhere between, and surely comes handy in case of Poland..

Cita: "Jarcek"​I wish I could say we will discuss it at admin meeting, but that could be god knows when...
​
​Cycnos is technically right, but I suspect there will be some oposition for full move under Exonumia. Cyrillius is right that we can easily filter them.
​
​Separate currency is somewhere between, and surely comes handy in case of Poland..

​Agree. Patters are not coins but also they are not exonumia at least in my opinion. When you put this kind of "coins" in one bag with ie. fantasy issues you make them harm as they closer to be a coin then any other things in exonumia. This "pre-coins" as i call them should have a separate section. Like this :
* Tokens *
** Exonumia **
*** Patterns ***
or new section along with :
Countries and territories
Ancient coins
Non UN states
Micronations
Patterns

Regards,
Damian

And the whole issue of whether patterns are exonumia or not are complicated by "pattern" coins that we are unsure whether they are true patterns or just fantasies from a later date, for example this German (Prussian) 20 Mark "patterns" from 1913, located under Exonumia: https://en.numista.com/catalogue/pieces83703.html

In the Pakistan section everything is mixed up: circulating coins and patterns. This makes it much harder to navigate. I would prefer to have them together at the end.

When will we have the new Guidelines with definitions of what to put in coins and what in tokens or Exonumia?

Just to throw in my two penn'orth, I am firmly of the belief that official Patterns/Trial Strikes should not be mixed up with the regular coinage but should have their own 'currency' within the main catalogue, much as is done within Krause. For example, in the Numista UK catalogue, we have a 'currency' for pre-decimal Patterns/Trial Strikes which sits right below the main pre-decimal coinage. So that would put me in the Option 1 camp.

Cita: "zegeri"​When will we have the new Guidelines with definitions of what to put in coins and what in tokens or Exonumia?

​Added to New Year wishes.

I agree with what Radrick said.

Mike